Macedonia on a map by Comberford, 1647!

This map is called “The portolan of the Mediterranean” and is made by Nicholas Comberford in 1647. Original size 90×47 cm, scale 1:4250000.
Here is a better picture of it in color, please click HERE.

There is also a version of it made in 1626, I will try and add it to my collection.

One question that comes to mind is, where is Greece?

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39 Responses to “Macedonia on a map by Comberford, 1647!”

  1. Kastor Says:

    Thats great but doesnt change anything, this has been a region for 1000 years like for eg, the Grand canyon or the blue mountains. It was never a nationit neaver had a leader or head of state.
    This firytale that Macedonia was once a nation has no basis, everything we know proves it was a kingdom of Greece.

    Megas Alexandros son of a Greek

  2. makedonika Says:

    Kastor, Macedonia has had the same name for ~2500 years, would you be so kind and tell us the name of Greece during the same time frame?

    Just for the fun of it, what was the name of the area that would become Greece in 1829, during the East Roman Empire.

    Could you please tell us Kastor?

    Ps. Alexander the Macedonian was not a son of a Greek but rather of a Macedonian, namely Phillip II. Ds.

  3. eleni Says:

    the name of greece was the name we have now-hellas,the people were hellenes or achaoi,or danaoi-prehistoric names and alexander was the king of hellenes,the commander of their army against the persians.at the end of his life he thought he was son of ammon ra -the egyptian god who was the similar with zeus.alexandros was maniac et the end,no dubt,but still a greek lunetic.he deffinetly was not a slavian,he spoke greek not slavian language-his name by the way meens ‘deffents men ‘,the name fillipos meens “friend of horses-filos – ippon in greek, and thessaloniki meens ‘victory above thessalians’it is not solun,its still thessaloniki for more 2600 years.

  4. eleni Says:

    by the way when did the slaves came in this area known as macedonia?i think you came after 600 years after jesus born,am i wrong?

    • Zlatko Says:

      Hey friend nothing is for sure unless somebody has been in that time and returned, it could be possible that one theory says that the slav people become from macedonian people who went to live in nord and east

  5. eleni Says:

    slavs

  6. eleni Says:

    by the way macedonians were a doric race,like spartans, they thouhgt their ancestor was hercules(heraclis in greek pronounse) and their name comes from the word makednos,which meens tall in ancient greek.makedonia is the “nation of the tall peaple” .

  7. eleni Says:

    sorry,the exact translation is the land of tall peaple

  8. Sarafot Says:

    Bravo be!!!
    Vakvi ni trebat na nas kako so si ti!
    Nekoj so jaki argumenti!
    Pocit kon se so rabotis za Makedonija!
    Gi koristam tvoite sozdanija na YOU TUBE,se nadevam deka ne se lutes?

    Poseti go mojot kanal da vides,a pravam i reklama za stranata.

    Ako nedavas soglasnost,ke gi trgnam videata!

    Pozdrav i samo taka napred,istinata e so nas.

  9. makedonika Says:

    @Sarafot

    ne se lutam batka, postiraj sho sakash. Vistinata treba da se znaje, ako mozhesh postiraj gi linkovite za tvojite video filomvi na you tube i tuka.

    Te blagodaram.

    Samo napred.

  10. John Says:

    This does not prove anything!
    Macedonia at that time was simply a province in the Ottoman Empire and a geographical region that bears its name from the ancient kingdom Macedon.This kongdom Macedon eventually became a province in the ancient Greek empire.Later we can see the name “Macedonia” in maps of the Roman Empire,The Bulgarian Empires and the Ottoman Empire.I can’t see what good does that make for the inhabitants of that region? Does it make them proud to see their land was the province of all Balkan empires?
    And by the way we see also Dalmatia,Sicilia etc. on that map but do we have today Republic of Dalmatia or Republic of Sicilia? Take even Thrace!Can you imagine Republic of Thrace?! It is simply ridicoulous creating countries on the basis of geographical names!!!

  11. makedonika Says:

    @John

    This proves a very crucial point, Greek propaganda claims that there never was a Macedonia at all. But as always Greeks LIE, as we easily can see from this map is that the Greek claim is false. We also see that the area that was to become called as “Greece” in 1829 was called as Achaia and Morea.

    The thing you as a Greek should ask yourself is, why have I been LIED to?

  12. makedonika Says:

    @eleni

    Alexander was the King of the Hellens, as Tsar Dushan in the 14th century AD was King of the MACEDONIANS.

    I think you need to sharpen your propaganda skills.

  13. slavjanski Says:

    Very interesting.

    My father was born in Krusoradi(Ahlada – new greece name), since 1913 part of Greece.
    And for miracle he is Macedonian, and he spoke Macedonian.
    And my grandfather Alekso, born 1902 in Krusoradi also Macedonian.
    Is this miracle ?
    And father of my grandfather Atanas also Macedonian born in Krusoradi, 1878.
    Wauuuuuuu, Macedonians exist more then 150 years.
    Wauuu they are not from time of Tito and Kominterna.
    How is it possible?
    And today I cant return my land in Krusoradi (Ahlada), I have papers for this land, and where is the justice ?
    Only Greeks can return day land?
    And way Greece in our Macedonia dont have catastar.
    Greece the center of culture and civilization.
    Bla bla blaaa.

    And for Greece people, why you don’t learn any more Demosten ?

    And you are Greeks, Elini, Macedonians, Tesalian, Trakians, Atinaian, Tebas.
    How many names you have ?

    We have just one, Macedonian, from time of Perdika.
    700 b.c.

  14. Владимир Says:

    Леле аман од бугарите и од другите кои викаат дека Македонија било географски поим
    Смешно
    Ако е Македонија населена со Македонци како ќе се вика?
    Македонија
    Бугарија=Бугари
    Србија=Срби
    Грција=Грци
    Хрватска=Хрвати.
    Еве ви еден куп примероци..

    Смешни сте..
    Тоа име постои повеќе од 2500 години на мапите……

  15. Ivica Says:

    this is only proof for what can do very powerful propaganda, leave own generations blind and brain-washed, don’t giving them a chance to think by theirselves

  16. Ivica Says:

    @makedonika
    mnogu me izraduva tvojata rabota, gledam deka imas koristeno napitsi od new york times, pa dokolku gi nemas site, jas imam nekoja kolekcija sto mislam deka moze da ti posluzi
    pozdrav

  17. Planino Says:

    Wow!!! OK you have won, Thessaloniki and Mount Olympus are yours!
    As soon as heroic Brat Boskoski escapes from detention at the Hague (for suspected crimes against humanity), you can start ethnically cleansing all 2 million Greek Macedonians from Macedonian!!!!

  18. DIMITRIOS Says:

    Why discombobulate archeological and historical facts to justify a nation state? Dude the map refers to a geographic area not a nation state. With your faulty logic residents of Achaia, Dalmatia, Anatolia, Proventia would all claim ethnical and national identity as justification for claining a nation stste status.

    Tell us the last time you heard of the distinct Dalmatian, Provence, or Anatolian people, their kingdom or state. What does it mean to be a dalmatian and for that matter an italian in 1647?

    You can spend a lifetime publishing every geographic refence you find to macedonia but its just that a geographic reference .You will never overcome the fact that your country is artificial and created based on a myth.
    Anchoring your raison d’être on fables will surely only postpone the eventual day of reckoning

    Finally religion which has been so integral to identity in the Balkans fails to live up to your illusions. You hark back to the possibility that Macedonians existed as a distinct identity prior to the 18th century and yet there is no evidence in your religion. You have always belonged to the Patriarchate of Constantinople and later on Serbian or Bulgarian Orthodox church. Could it be that your own church never considered itself Macedonian, separate from Serbia and Bulgaria? Why wait till the 20th century to claim to be autocephalous status? Why no Macedonian Monastery at Mount Athos not even a skete? The Serbs, Russians, Bulgarians, Romanians even the Georgians have their own.

  19. Graditel Says:

    STUPID greeks , answer me this , if Philip and Aleksandar was greeks , why they to conquer all greeks ,and kill him like animals. How is possible to be in same time, Macedonian and greek( greek are steal our history , this is pruf )

    Еве и на Македонски на истиот јазик што го збореле Филип и Александар , значи ако Филип и Александар биле грци зошто ги поробиле сите грци и зошто ги испотепале како животни.

  20. makedonika Says:

    @Ivica

    Super, ke ti pratam poraka na tvojot email.

  21. Ivica Says:

    swearing and humiliating, these things only left for paranoid greeks.
    the ancient cradle of democracy today is known like country with greedy appetites for neighbouring countries and nations, whole world’s evolution is in way of living together and prosperity but greeks evolution is going backwards

  22. Jovan Says:

    To Dimitros

    Answer to all these questions is that after the Macedonian Kingdom Of Alexandar the Macedonian, all parties involved had one thing in mind: making sure that this will not happen again…so much blood. Hellenic people after the fall of the Mac Kingdom made sure that Macedonians will never compose them selves to a state. And this was greatly supported by all big nations at a time, and it’s reflected today.
    Alexandar has embraced the Hellenic culture and civilisation, i’ll give you that. But he was a Macedonian, not helen. And yes, the region on the map, in all books it’s presented as a geographical area, not state. But a geographical area populated mainly of Macedonians, not Greeks, Serbs, Bulgarians… And we never have had enough power to have a state. Occupied all the time (history is written by the winners)
    To support this (besides the well known Greek genocide of the Macedonians past century), my grand grand parent is Macedonian. He had 3 surnames (3 birth certificates): Ristov, Ristic and Ristos. All marking the occupation times of our people. We were struggling for centuries to get our country back, never managed that until Tito. I am not a communist, but, hey, Tito, thank you. YOU are my greatest hero. You are the reason why my son today is not called Ristos or Ristic.
    The fact is, it’s 21 century now. Greece cannot hide the Macedonian minority in Greece any more. Neither can Bulgaria. And as long we do not change our name, we have the justice on our side and tools to reach that justice. Sooner or later, our minority will have their rights recognized.
    We have come to terms with Greece and Bulgaria annexing our past territories. I romantically want them back, but it will never happen and i am OK with that, as are almost ALL Macedonians. What we want now is to look forward to our future in these borders (Albanians permitting :)), have a decent life, without having neighbours like Greece and Bulgaria threatening my identity and integrity.
    For that you can just f..k off! For sitting with me on a table as a Greek and Macedonian, eating, sharing and laughing like good neighbours, you are always most welcome.

  23. Jovan Says:

    and Dimitros, by the way, – “discombobulate”? wow. well done. khm.

  24. Perdika Says:

    Bravo za sajtov, sekoja cest za kreatorot!
    eve nesto za tie sto ne zborat makedonski:

    Greece is the only country in the world that claims it is ethnically clean, which is ridiculous, knowing that today’s world knows no ethnically clean country. Greece – cradle of democracy? There is no bigger lie. If Greece is a democratic country, it will allow the right of the minorities to identify themselves. But I don’t blame the Greeks – they’ve been brainwashed for years and as a result, it is very very hard for them to accept the truth. We have seen on the news what kind of barbarian behavior Greece is demonstrating – demolishing the house of a Macedonian priest, threatening the Macedonians, Turks and Albanians with a terrorist video clip… a democratic country doesn’t act like that! Greece should accept the fact that there is a country called Macedonia, there are Macedonians who speak macedonian language, there is a Macedonian church… In fact, recently a Greek priest told all this in an interview for a macedonian television, but the greeks of course do not publish this in their media, which is understable because it is against their propaganda and bunch of lies. The veto is another story…a world humiliation for greece.

    DA ZIVEE MAKEDONIJA!
    ONE NAME WE HAVE – MACEDONIA!

  25. Makedonec/macedonian Says:

    What can i say???
    Well, this.
    Macedonia was, Macedonia is and Macedonia will always be Macedonia. Egej-, Pirin- and Vardar-.

    For the Athens (greeks).
    The truht hurts.
    No matter how much force is used on us……. we will always remain PROUD MACEDONIANS.

    Da ziveé Makedonija

  26. Dean Says:

    Dear Geeks,
    We know that you are good people but you are wrong. The worst thing is that you politicians are inventing some stupid history of our sacred land MACEDONIA in order to justify all atrocities committed against Macedonians.
    Please give us Solun back and give as apologies for your grandfathers crimes against our people.

    God bless MACEDONIA.

  27. chris Says:

    Dear Macedonians,
    Balcans is a European region where history has gained the attention of many people along our countries. Being a Balcan premice a histoy of at least 2.000-3.000 years. The worst thing for all other nationalities in Balcans is that only Greece has this privilege. In case you want to think about it please read some references of world history, not the ones that both of us have been studied in school, or just google the name Alexander the Great. It is not out of question the fact that Hollywood in the recent movie “Great Alexander” has taked as given the fact that Alexander was Greek, and believe me we have no power on Americans, that’s for sure. We cannot fool all the world for hundrends of years. Anyway the fact that in all over the world the students are being taught that Macedonias is a greek city-state in northern Greece is undoubtable. In the Macadonias monuments, you can visit Vergina, Dion, or Pella, (there are open museums to everyone) you will have the chance to certify that all the monuments have upon them Greek characters from the Greek alphabet. We have the same alphabet for over 2.500 years, we speak the same language (of cource now has been modernised). We also use ancient and christian names indicating the continuality of our history. The slavian alphabet which is used from Bulgarians, Serbs, Croatians, Macedonians is the one which two Greeks from Konstantinopoles taught the habitants of the region where you live in, Cyrill and Methodios. Slavs is a great nation, with history and culture and I think that nobody needs to peculate other nations characteristics. Everone on this chersonece has its own past, its own history. I am not using 100% historical arguments because the dialog between us can take to long, i just use common sence.
    My friends you are victims of NATO vs. USSR cold war propaganda. Of course there are some people who speak this kind of language in northern Greece, it is a mixture of Macedonian and Bulgarians, don’t forget that during the Othoman Empire, balcans were messed up and all the nations were everywhere, e.g. Macedonians in greece, greeks in bulgary or albania etc. After the fall of the Othoman Empire we built our countries according to nationalities. Although the populations were not moved entirely. Many of them stayed in their homes despite the fact that their home was in Greece and they were Macedonians. That is the story. There is nothing sneaking here. These things have been happened in all over the world.
    You must accept that you are not macedonias but Slavs there is nothing wrong with that, you must be proud of your ancestors.
    In one way or another history built on a lie is not a history but a myth.
    You need to become part of the 3.000 years history, unfortynately this is out of question. You cannot, as for example Portugese or Americans cannot, but Italians can, it depends on the nation and its history.
    You are a small coyntry and dependent on us, do not trust your “friends” they are going to use you, they have done tha same thing with us.

    Edited by makedonika: there is no skopjan/slavijan/slav-macedonian nationality, language nor ethnicity, you must mean Macedonian.
    Or are you refering to the inhabitants of Skopia in Florina Prefecture, Greece, when you use the term skopjan???

  28. chris Says:

    No I am not refering to Macedonians, there are only Greek Macedonians in Greece and Macedonians and Albanians in the Republic of Macedonia nothing more nothing less. If you want to find your nationality please ask the Bulgarians they can give you some, your ex prime minister did this and other 10000 coyntrymen have bulgarian passport. Is it by accident? Probably they know better or they got bored with this show. Do not worry the liar cannot obscure the truth.

    Edited by makedonia: Macedonians and the Republic of Macedonia, please!

  29. Dean Says:

    My dear Greek Friends,

    I admire your interest how to defend something that is indefensible. ¿Do you think that more then 100 countries worldwide, including China, Russia, Canada or USA, don’t have history knowledge to know the truth about our history? , ¿Do you think that some small country like REPUBLIC OF MACEDONIA has the politic power to influence more then 100 countries with lies? NO my friends.

    The truth is always winning. Your politicians are consent that they are loosing this point and in their desperation they are trying to find any dirty method to stop our recognition, even offering us money to accept something unacceptable. We are not selling our identity. We don’t need your money, only your respect.

    I believe that one day this point will be something forgotten for us and we can be respected like always we have respected you.

    Good bless MACEDONIA

  30. chris Says:

    Dear Dean,
    It’s really funny the way you think the whole issue. Nobody in the world care about our argument neither China nor USA. Policy is policy and history is history. The rest of the world doesn’t care about history, we care about history and you care for both of them. The reason is that you want to gain political stability and a place in international organizations by constructing a nation and a history that will help you to gain respect. You believe something that nobody in the world gives a shit, for example I don’t care if Scotland will change its name to New Scotland or North Scotland or even England. If this is so, do you think that the rest of them can see our problem? Don’t forget that there is a 30% of Albanians, are they “Macedonians” too?
    Last but not least, you do need our money, you are a poor country and a small market, no country except your neighbours will invest to your country, this is a one way trip. In case we let you down you will be history in a year. Be realistic you can’t close your eyes to the ultimate truth.

  31. John Says:

    Makedonika,

    Take a look at these maps, you will find them most informative:
    http_//historyofmacedonia.wordpress.com/2008/04/01/maps-and-politics/

  32. Joco Says:

    And Chris what are you actually proud of?

    Go to Russia please… together with the fat black and dirty pig Karamanlis buy some weapons from them. And remember GOD HAS OPEN EYES !!!

  33. Svac Says:

    @ John
    thank you for the link, it’s big proof that anti-Macedonian propaganda is not from these days but it has deep roots in your and bulgarian history

  34. Svac Says:

    it’s fact that greek economy did a rapid progress after occupation of Aegean Macedonia 1913, simply they can’t survive without Aegean Macedonia because the rest of their state is rocks and mountains. That fact explains their desire to have Macedonia

  35. John Says:

    @Svac
    Keep a cool head and read history again.
    There was no Macedonian Ethnic Entity before the Balkan wars. Many and different ethnic/religious communities lived in Geographic Macedonia before 1913. The “..occupation of Aegean Macedonia..” is a figment of the political imagination of your community. Quite a few of the political leaders from your community, have clearly stated that you are a nation of slavs (some of them have even obtained Bulgarian passports). We can all be proud of our backgrounds. We don’t have to distort them. And most importantly, let’s spend our energies toward building a better future, and NOT toward rewriting the past.

    Commented by makedonika: John you are very wrong, the Macedonians were there some of them were influenced by the heavy propaganda that was unleashed on them by their neighbouring countries, but they were still Macedonians.
    To get a better understanding of the situation you should read the letters by Theodosius/Teodosij. Follow this link:
    http://makedonika.wordpress.com/2008/03/06/teodosij-renewal-of-the-archbishopric-of-ohrid-1891/

  36. chris Says:

    Svac

    Nobody so far has done any comment on the above mentioned evidence. Never mind keep up with your work. You are probably afraid to face the truth.
    A comment for Svac:
    Please come in Greece, you will find out that beyond the mountains we also have islands, industry, services etc, and of course tourism for our culture and civilization.
    We don’t want your state, it’s useless to us, we don’t want to feed 2 more million people.

  37. Katerina Says:

    Hi Everyone!

    I keep seeing the same question over and over again; the G***ks would like to know why we didn’t have a church before the 20th century. Before I go on with the answer, I’d first like to ask if they are aware of what happened on January 16, 1767?

    In an attempt to arrogate the autocephalous Ohrid Church in 1737, according to the historian and former Secretary at the British Embassy in Constantinople from 1893 to 1898, Charles Eliot, “John Ypsilanti tried to persuade the Porte that Ohrid was a centre of Austrian intrigue and ought to be directly subordinated to Constantinople”. The Patriarchate argued that under such circumstances the church of Ohrid would have to come under the jurisdiction of the Patriarchate. Under pressure from the Ottomans, Archbishop Arsenius was removed as the head of the Archbishopric of Ohrid on 16 January 1767. This was followed by an irade (royal act) from Sultan Mustafa III (1757–1773) abolishing the Archbishopric of Ohrid as an autocephalous institution. The abolition of the church was initiated by the Constantinople Patriarch (Samuil Handzheri 1763–1768), and un-canonically administered by a Muslim ruler. Playing into each other’s hands, the Ottoman Turks and Greeks developed a long-standing relationship under which, “the Sultan could never have crushed the heart out of his Christian subjects without the aid of a Christian middleman, and the Greek has used the brute force of his Mohammedan employer to complement his own cleverness and guile”, G.M. Mackenzie and A.P. Irby, The Slavonic Provinces of Turkey in Europe, London 1866, p. 29.

    “The abolition of the Macedonian Archbishopric of Ohrid emerged from political manouvering, and was motivated by a desire to strengthen the position of the Patriarchate in non-Greek territories under Ottoman rule”, C. Eliot, Turkey in Europe, London, 1965 (1900) p. 251.
    “The Macedonian church was annexed to the Patriarchate of Constantinople, which took ecclesiastical control of Macedonia and, in place of native Bishops of one interest with the people, Greeks were sent from Constantinople”, G.M. Mackenzie and A.P. Irby, The Slavonic Provinces of Turkey in Europe, London 1866, p. 29.
    Greek bishops and metropolitans reinforced Greek religious domination in Macedonia by attempting to wipe out traces of the Macedonian character of the Archbishopric of Ohrid. They set upon destroying centuries-old books, records and religious texts and often replaced Macedonian church inscriptions with Greek. In monasteries on the Holy Mountain of Sveta Gora, ‘the Greek clergy acted drastically’, throwing old Macedonian parchments into the sea or burning them in furnaces, and at the Monastery of Saint Naum on Lake Ohrid, the Greek prior Dionysius burned the manuscripts. In Prilep there was a burning of the religious books, whilst the books stored at Veles were destroyed in a bonfire in the marketplace under the orders of the Greek bishop. As much as 300 kilograms of parchments and religious books belonging to the Ohrid Archbishopric were gone forever. “Macedonia – Its People and History, The Pensylvannia State University Press, 1982, p. 108. The library of the Patriachs of Trnovo in Bulgaria, although surviving significantly longer, was destroyed by fire in 1825 at the hands of the Greek Metropolitan Hilarion”, The journalist, J.D. Bourchier, The Balkan States – Their Attitude Towards the Macedonian Question, New York, 1905, p. 52.

    Now do you all want a lesson in how the Exarchate was formed?

  38. Daniel Says:

    http://www.igenea.com/index.php?content=132&st=287

    eve malku fakti ne politicka propaganda


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